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#1 2010-04-06 10:11:40

Draken
Guild Member
From: Denmark
Registered: 2005-08-17
Posts: 1912

Upcoming Cataclysm Dispel Mechanics

We wanted to introduce some of the changes to dispel mechanics coming in Cataclysm. Our goals were to make dispelling a little less trivial to do in PvP, and to make sure there is more equity in dispel capabilities among healers in both PvP and PvE.

Within the system, there are currently five types of dispellable (or curable) buffs and debuffs: curse, disease, poison, defensive magic, and offensive magic. An example of defensive magic dispelling would be using a dispel to free a polymorphed ally, while offensive magic dispelling would be utilizing a dispel ability to strip away an enemy’s buff or heal-over-time (HoT) spell. The main distinction between these two types is in whether or not you can target an enemy with your dispel.

In Cataclysm each healing class will be getting three out of the five types of dispels, with one of these always being a defensive dispel magic. This design makes sure that finding a healer with the ability to remove magic isn’t restrictive in building teams for Arenas or rated Battlegrounds. It also allows the encounter designers to assume, when designing dungeon or raid fights, that every group can dispel magic.

In addition, we're making the opportunity cost (what the player could have accomplished with different actions) for dispelling a bit steeper. We think the cost is too low for three reasons: 1) The actual mana cost is low. 2) You never waste a dispel. If you try to dispel a debuff that isn’t there then the dispel just won’t go off. 3) We have spells that remove debuffs with minimal input on the part of the player. In Cataclysm we are raising the mana costs, making it possible to waste mana by casting a dispel when there is nothing to dispel, and removing Cleansing Totem, Abolish Disease, and Abolish Poison from the game. With these changes in mind, we are working to plan dungeon and raid encounters where dispels aren’t in constant demand or spammed in order to be successful, though some need for dispels will still be a part of the design.

As previously mentioned, we are providing three dispel capabilities to all healing classes as follows:

    * Druids will be able to dispel defensive magic, curses, and poison.
    * Paladins will be able to dispel defensive magic, diseases, and poison.
    * Priests will be able to dispel defensive magic, offensive magic, and disease.
    * Shaman will be able to dispel defensive magic, offensive magic, and curses.


There is some trade-off that is being made in making these changes and we wanted to expand on this further.

    * Protection and Retribution paladins will lose their current ability to dispel magic.
    * All shaman will lose dispel disease and dispel poison in exchange for Restoration gaining dispel magic.
    * Restoration shaman, Restoration druids, and Holy paladins will need to talent into their defensive magic dispels.
    * Shadow priests won’t be able to remove disease in Shadowform.
    * Mage, hunter, and warlock will retain their current dispel mechanics.
    * Body and Soul remains the same, and basically any dispel mechanic not mentioned above is currently planned to remain as it is.
    * When possible, we’d like to combine dispels into a single action. For example, the druid ability to dispel curses and poisons might be a single spell with a Restoration talent that also allows it to dispel magic. This part of the design isn’t finalized, however.


As with all of our Cataclysm previews, keep in mind that any of these decisions could change when we’re in beta.


"You called down the thunder, now reap the whirlwind!"

"You got an organ going there, no wonder the sound has so much body!"

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#2 2010-04-06 11:03:28

Ludicrous
Guild Member
From: Oulu, Finland
Registered: 2006-03-30
Posts: 30

Re: Upcoming Cataclysm Dispel Mechanics

You no take candle!

Cleansing totem! But hell, it sounds like there's not going to be so much need for dispelling in PvE so it also sounds like the need throwing down a cleansing totem will disappear also. Still, one of my favorite tools to have as a healer.

I do like that change where you can waste mana/gcd for dispelling something that isn't there.


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#3 2010-04-06 13:54:24

Mox
Officer
From: Norway - Oslo
Registered: 2007-09-03
Posts: 1493

Re: Upcoming Cataclysm Dispel Mechanics

There will probably be less dispelling in PvE, but the dispelling we do get to do might be more important than it is now. Necrotic Plague is an example of a very interesting mechanic.


Retired Priest master.

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#4 2010-04-07 13:05:49

Draken
Guild Member
From: Denmark
Registered: 2005-08-17
Posts: 1912

Re: Upcoming Cataclysm Dispel Mechanics

Based on a lot of feedback and concerns being raised in this thread and mirrored threads in other regions, we'd like to make a few clarifications in no particular order.

    * Shaman will get Cleanse Spirit as a base spell that removes curses. Restoration will have a talent to add magic dispelling (on friends or enemies) to Cleanse Spirit.

    * We recognize this change risks making shaman too vulnerable to rogue and hunter poisons in PvP (and especially mind-numbing), and we might very well offer a talent or mechanic to compensate for that.

    * We also recognize the challenge for magic-based controllers in PvP, say mages, to handle teams with druid healers and we might have to reconsider the druid ability to avoid Polymorph. We think it’s important for PvE reasons for all healers to be able to dispel magic however.

    * For the most part, talents that reduce a chance to be dispelled are going away. We want dispels to be more expensive, but we also want them to be effective when you do choose to use them, so we want to downplay the random aspect. Mechanics such as Unholy Blight granting dispel immunity, or rogues reapplying poisons so quickly will be handled on an individual basis. We’ve had a little bit of an arms race going on because some of those debuffs could be removed so trivially; but on the other hand, death knights and rogues need those debuffs to function. Balancing that will be an ongoing process.

    * We also want to downplay the role of “junk buffs” that protect dispels. Our usual course of action here is to make those buffs undispellable such that you dispel the thing you actually want to dispel.

    * If we didn’t mention a specific dispel mechanic (like Shield Slam), then you can assume it probably isn’t changing, at least for now. A lot may change in beta.

    * We want to stress yet again that one of our goals behind these changes was to help us design 5-player dungeons and 10-player raids. Currently having the ability to remove, say, a poison or disease can make an encounter go from challenging to easy, yet not every group has those abilities. With this new matrix, the encounter designers can make anything that must be dispelled a magical effect, while curses, poisons or diseases would be in the category of helping you win, but not an instant wipe if you lose. In 25-player raids, we have more flexibility to ask you to dispel more types of effects.

    * We understand that in some cases we are making changes that have been core to some classes for a long time (shaman losing poison and disease dispel for instance). While we don’t want to make any beloved classes, or even spells unrecognizable to players who have stuck with that class for years, Cataclysm is also an opportunity for us to fix some of the class systems and mechanic issues we've had for a long time. We have to be careful about having too many sacred cows that keep us from being able to iterate on the design. The dispel matrix we had was somewhat arbitrary and could change a PvE encounter or PvP battle dramatically, almost in a binary manner, depending on what dispels were available to the group involved. When dispelling is trivial, either because it’s too easy or because someone is capable of dispelling too many things, then neither PvE or PvP feel as strategic or tactical as we think they ideally could be.

    * Defensive dispels (say, a shaman removing a debuff from an ally) should always hit. We don’t want healers to have to stack +hit for PvE. When you are dispelling buffs on an enemy, you will still have a chance to miss.


"You called down the thunder, now reap the whirlwind!"

"You got an organ going there, no wonder the sound has so much body!"

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