The Enigma Order

Mojorising · 2008-04-25 14:06:48

Before reading, just to make some sense:
For those who doesnt know, RAWR is some software developed too make comparisons between gear. you have a million options such as set bonuses, gems, enchants, skill rotations, boss armor, drums of battle/war/... you name it!! is it possible in WOW, you can get it here..
This post is made, due to the fact that both the software, and the developer tells me not to focus on hitrating, but other people tells me otherwise.

Link to RAWR: http://druid.wikispaces.com/Rawr

____________________________________________________________________________________

I have been playing around with RAWR for alittle now, but i got the problem that it removed my hit rating to benefit other stats more (like agility gems etc). I thought it was a bug, so i posted a question on Druid wiki Rawr forum:

I got a small question about the calculations about catform dps, gear and gem choices.

In my current gear im at 142 hit rating.
When i select all my gear/gem choices from Rawr, it completly ignore hit gems, and only suggest i go with Agi gems (except 1 item) when i start optimizing.
It has no problems selecting 2 x T4 over other items which is awsome, but it seems that it doesnt care about how much hit i got

Is there some way to tell the program, that i want to maintain my 142 hit rating nomatter what?

Here are the responses i got:
1st guy:

Im sure it's still factoring in the hit in the calculations, but the other items must be still superior. Why would you want to sacrifice overall dps for being exactly on the hit cap?

2nd guy (the owner and creator of RAWR):

You can add an Additional Requirement in the Optimizer, for Avoided Attacks %. Set that to <= 0 if you want to maintain no misses. That's absolutely terrible for your overall DPS though.

All this got me a bit confused. I was sure, that every raider with a bit of respect for them selfes where hit capped. Getting told that my hit cap produces terrible dps compaired too what i could do, without beeing capped really got me thinking... how far should i go with hit? should i say screw every "overgemming" of hit i have made and try to get some gear thats alittle more focused on raw dps?

Mojorising · 2008-04-25 14:10:27

my current gear:

Head Grimgrin Faceguard
Neck Choker of Vile Intent
Shoulders Mantle of Malorne
Chest Breastplate of Malorne
Waist Don Alejandro's Money Belt
Legs Leggings of Murderous Intent
Feet Nyn'jah's Tabi Boots
Wrist Vambraces of Ending
Hands Thunderheart Gauntlets
Finger1 Band of the Eternal Champion
Finger2 Angelista's Revenge
Trinket1 Tsunami Talisman
Trinket2 Shard of Contempt
Back Razor-Scale Battlecloak
MainHand Staff of Primal Fury
Ranged Everbloom Idol
Tabard Cenarion Expedition Tabard
Character: mojorising@EU-stormreaver
Race: NightElf
Health: 9304
Attack Power: 3408
Agility: 643
Strength: 223
Crit Rating: 104
Hit Rating: 142
Expertise Rating: 44
Haste Rating: 0
Armor Penetration: 441
Weapon Damage: +0
Avoided Attacks: 3,709756%
White Crit: 38,19015%
Yellow Crit: 36,77339%
Attack Speed: 1s
Armor Mitigation: 40,74313%
Shreds Per Cycle: 2,170825
Cycle Time: 12,6425s
4cp Finishers: 72,95193%
5cp Finishers: 27,04807%
Mangle Damage: 8,232166%
Shred Damage: 29,27661%
Melee Damage: 32,33545%
Rip Damage: 30,15578%
Bite Damage: 0%
DPS Points: 812,4115
Overall Points: 812,4115

Suggested upgrades:

Head Nordrassil Headdress
Neck Vindicator's Pendant of Triumph
Shoulders Mantle of Malorne
Chest Breastplate of Malorne
Waist Don Alejandro's Money Belt
Legs Leggings of Murderous Intent
Feet Nyn'jah's Tabi Boots
Wrist Vambraces of Ending
Hands Thunderheart Gauntlets
Finger1 Band of the Eternal Champion
Finger2 Angelista's Revenge
Trinket1 Tsunami Talisman
Trinket2 Shard of Contempt
Back Razor-Scale Battlecloak
MainHand Staff of Primal Fury
Ranged Everbloom Idol
Tabard Cenarion Expedition Tabard
Character: MOJORISING@EU-STORMREAVER
Race: NightElf
Health: 9164
Attack Power: 3497
Agility: 682
Strength: 270
Crit Rating: 138
Hit Rating: 61
Expertise Rating: 44
Haste Rating: 0
Armor Penetration: 441
Weapon Damage: +0
Avoided Attacks: 8,841464%
White Crit: 41,29%
Yellow Crit: 37,63936%
Attack Speed: 1s
Armor Mitigation: 40,74313%
Shreds Per Cycle: 2,228951
Cycle Time: 12,73549s
4cp Finishers: 71,62582%
5cp Finishers: 28,37418%
Mangle Damage: 8,469089%
Shred Damage: 29,23605%
Melee Damage: 32,64698%
Rip Damage: 29,64788%
Bite Damage: 0%
DPS Points: 829,796
Overall Points: 829,796

notice how it suggest that i only use 61 hitrating, and the rest of the gems are mainly agi gems

Enimusha · 2008-04-25 14:13:29

I still think hit rating is the best stat before the cap, and after that pure agility for dps. Before i got hit capped with my feralol, i was doing quite sucky dps, after hitting the cap my dps was kinda okay.

Hit rating makes you avoid lost energy on finishers and cp skills, i dont know how good that RAWR calculates that.

Also, there is a point when your crit goes over the top, so to speak, when you get too much combo points to use them effectively anymore. Though crit is the best stat for druids damage wise.

Maybe our rogues and warriors can enlighten us wannabe melees in this?

Mojorising · 2008-04-25 14:34:02

For me it seems like it suggest that i gain rougly 18 dps, but sacrificing alot of hit.

On my current gear it says:
Avoided Attacks: 3,709756%
(3,7% dodged, 0% missed)

On the suggested:
Avoided Attacks: 8,841464%
(3.7% dodged, 5,1% missed)

Still with these changes i would see an dps increase on rougly 18 dps.

(all is unbuffed, so raid wise it would be improved)

Mojorising · 2008-04-25 14:44:07

I tried to add some buffs, to check out the gap when raid buffed:
Buffs used are the following:
imp. MotW
BS
Bom
BoK
Unleashed rage
Heroic presence
Elixir of major agi
20 agi food
Adamantite weapon buff
FF
Sunder armor x 5

Current raidbuffed:
Overall Points: 1214,118

Suggested raidbuffed:
Overall Points: 1251,776

The dps difference gets larger the more raid buffed i get.

Windir · 2008-04-25 15:15:12

i don't know for druids, but for hunters atleast, its not really needed to reach the 142 hit rating cap for most encounters. (however, i' not really sure about that)

Beardstorm · 2008-04-25 21:26:21

For locks at least hitrating is better than anything else until hitcap. I can't see why it would be different for ferals, I imagine most damage comes from Shred (or whatever that attack is from behind), although I guess it depends on how much Shred damage scales with Agility (which I know nothing about).

Yeah my post is useless

Lydo · 2008-04-25 21:54:41

I'd say you should max hit rating to the point where you cant miss special attacks, but I think it is a bad stat for druids after that point.

Draken · 2008-04-25 22:05:25

Lydo wrote:
I'd say you should max hit rating to the point where you cant miss special attacks, but I think it is a bad stat for druids after that point.

As long as you aren't dualwielding the hit cap for normal melee attacks as well as special attacks is the same, the moment you start dualwielding special attacks still have the same hit cap as before, but melee attacks suddenly need alot more hit rating to cap, druids fall into the first case i believe.

Enimusha · 2008-06-07 23:51:03

Did you get any clarification for this Mojo? I have been testing out this some, and found out that +100 hit seems to give me more dps than nerfing myself with hit gear and going to +142... Dunno about reality, but the damage seems higher.

Mojorising · 2008-06-09 14:36:35

I took it to the offical Rawr forum:

http://druid.wikispaces.com/message/view/Rawr/3908877

Lamme · 2008-09-26 12:48:31

Does it allow you to set\assumes a lvl 73 mob?
I can't install it on ths computer (work), thus I'm aksing instead of trying myself.

Mojorising · 2008-09-26 13:25:52

there is a lot of tweaking, so i dont think it should be impossible.
I actually think it has a lvl 73 raidboss in mind, and you can change stuff like armor (and it will say what boss that fits what ammount of armor) etc.
Havent been playing with the program for quite some time, and i dont have it on my laptop, so i cant say for sure

Jazko · 2008-09-26 13:42:41

You can select target level 70 to 73 in options, along with pretty much every debuff (on boss) and buffs (on you) there is in the game.

Last edited by Jazko (2008-09-26 13:45:25)

The Enigma Order

Announcement

#1 2008-04-25 14:06:48

Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#2 2008-04-25 14:10:27

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#3 2008-04-25 14:13:29

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#4 2008-04-25 14:34:02

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#5 2008-04-25 14:44:07

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#6 2008-04-25 15:15:12

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#7 2008-04-25 21:26:21

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#8 2008-04-25 21:54:41

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#9 2008-04-25 22:05:25

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

Lydo wrote:

#10 2008-06-07 23:51:03

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#11 2008-06-09 14:36:35

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#12 2008-09-26 12:48:31

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#13 2008-09-26 13:25:52

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

#14 2008-09-26 13:42:41

Re: Im getting a bit confused - hit vs dps

Board footer